Yeah, they are the heaviest shoe though so they probably aren't as popular with runners.
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Jon’s musing about running and things about running while running and after running and probably before running too
- Thread starter global_dev
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I'm not a serious runner as I have made that apparent over and over again. But if I was...I would keep to my Hokas. Man those things are comfy! I thought they were going tp be weird at first...but they work well. I have done some running in them and I am super impressed.
global_dev
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seen a lot of love for the hoka brand, but also seen lost of people say that models sometime change so much from 1 year to next, cliftons, rincons (but that seems like a lot brands). I was looking at the speedgoats for a bit
global_dev
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read a lot recently coincidentally about hoka that the foam dies (compresses) way faster than other brands. feels great at the beginning but less lifespan. i'd be careful about how you feel after some miles in them and make sure you try on a fresh pair if you are feeling any tinges of pain.
been enjoying some time back in the trails again mostly. having a blast get back into the rhythm after not feeling that great for 2 weeks. crazy how fast you can lose some of that progress, mostly speed. not endurance. almost got run over by a pack of tourist hikers on my trail, oddly they went left as i was approaching and passing instead of staying to the right, forced me off the path. i'm not sure what they were thinking other than WTFun is this guy doing running at us at full speed up this hill. it was a nice 15K trail run in beautiful cool non windy winter/fall.
the weather has been all over the place and i've been slowly mentally preparing myself to get out way earlier. It's too hard right now to know that it's 35F at 8AM and 55F at noon and not want to wait for the warmer temps. today's tempo trail runs were super enjoyable. about 4.5miles in 40mins, a 15 min mile break and then 1.5mil in around 15mins. whats pretty wild is that i can feel control of all the movement from my toes to my glutes. trying to remember form; hoping i keep my right calf from spasms. my midfoot -ish strike feels kind of stompy, so i am trying to feel the natural lean that isn't too far forward and yet isn't too forefoot striking.
definitely missed the consistent running i was doing before, just sucks when you aren't feeling well and just too much coincides with masking changes over the last 2 months.
global_dev
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been running everyday.
yesterday I set out to do a 5K in 29 min, put on nike tempo next percent, some pretty cushioned shoes (Weight: 9.3oz, Drop: 10mm, Heel height: 46mm, Forefoot height: 36mm)
went way way too fast and killed the hills trying to maintain at least a 9min/pace and at 2.1 miles had to call it quits and walk the mile home, insane cushioning. I ended up with 8 minute miles
for those 2 miles. bittersweet, i would have liked to get around the entire course, the hills killed me, but it was almost as fast as my fasted 1 mile run back a year ago (7:57) so I just did 2 miles at slightly seconds slower, so i expect that i can get a new PR in a flat mile very soon.
todays session was intervals, i dont' recall what i mentioned about HR, but i was able to well match my Power zones and my HR zones with the Karvonen formula. I went out in Saucony Kinvara 11s, kind of the opposite of the tempos above. (Weight: 8.2oz, drop 4mm, Heel height: 29mm, Forefoot height: 25mm) .
i could feel the difference, night and day.. getting through the 3min high intensity sections was really hard, mostly found myself on the uphills when the time hit on my 5mile course, and the rests of 2 min were just enough for me to get my HR right,4 of these intervals. each 3 min section has me around 600 meters. not too bad for a bunch of ridiculous uphills.
yesterday I set out to do a 5K in 29 min, put on nike tempo next percent, some pretty cushioned shoes (Weight: 9.3oz, Drop: 10mm, Heel height: 46mm, Forefoot height: 36mm)
for those 2 miles. bittersweet, i would have liked to get around the entire course, the hills killed me, but it was almost as fast as my fasted 1 mile run back a year ago (7:57) so I just did 2 miles at slightly seconds slower, so i expect that i can get a new PR in a flat mile very soon.
todays session was intervals, i dont' recall what i mentioned about HR, but i was able to well match my Power zones and my HR zones with the Karvonen formula. I went out in Saucony Kinvara 11s, kind of the opposite of the tempos above. (Weight: 8.2oz, drop 4mm, Heel height: 29mm, Forefoot height: 25mm) .
global_dev
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Was feeling pretty good last night so before rhe temp in the area dropped too low and i still had some available sunlight i went for a nice easy 5K. I tried to keep a good easy pace and really engage hip/triple extension and let the glutes do the work. I still think it was too fast but it was an enjoyable change of scenery ar a place I hadn’t been to since october 2021. 30mins total in the minimal 4mm drop kinvara11s.
I didnt look at my watch at all and just tried to keep an even effort, i knew the into hill was gonna be slow and there was a ton of wind, but i did a pretty good job of keeping cadence and effort. The first mile gains all the elevation and the second 2 miles - barely notice the downhill after that halfway mark, maybe thats why it’s a nice enjoyable run. It definitely does not feel like a downhill for the last mile and change. Interestingly to me, to keep power even on a downhill you have to increase the pace, way harder than it sounds for me right now.
I didnt look at my watch at all and just tried to keep an even effort, i knew the into hill was gonna be slow and there was a ton of wind, but i did a pretty good job of keeping cadence and effort. The first mile gains all the elevation and the second 2 miles - barely notice the downhill after that halfway mark, maybe thats why it’s a nice enjoyable run. It definitely does not feel like a downhill for the last mile and change. Interestingly to me, to keep power even on a downhill you have to increase the pace, way harder than it sounds for me right now.
global_dev
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Yesterday was a beauty of a day. Kind of Goldilocks conditions a d i took full advantage to do a 20K trailrun while my daughter and her friend rode their bikes a bit in front of me. Half the time they rode, the other half was pushing the bike up the hills.
Tbh, i was really moving trying to keep pace kind of close to them, probably a bit too much effort and often found myself at a pace that was kind of a bit too fast and i felt it at the end. Had some kind bars and water trying to fuel and hydrate well as compared to previous sessions that had neither. Not sure it worked great, but it wasnt bad as far as i can tell. Took a tiny bit over 2 hrs. Legs were tired but got a chance to ride a bike for a mile home and it felt glorious compared to pavement pounding. I wasn’t expecting that at all.
I should have known better today to go out again, but it was so nice and i didnt feel bad at all. Mid 60s, but really high humidity, so much so it was almost drizzling. So the combo of humidity and general fatigue was not helping me, in fact i probably should have moved around the training and had a regen day, but i felt i could do a tempo run. I was almost right. Once i added in the hills, i was done for. Just killers today with the build up from yesterday.
I had to slow way way down at the end on the last uphill of and ended up do some downhill jogs to shake out the legs. Good times.
Tbh, i was really moving trying to keep pace kind of close to them, probably a bit too much effort and often found myself at a pace that was kind of a bit too fast and i felt it at the end. Had some kind bars and water trying to fuel and hydrate well as compared to previous sessions that had neither. Not sure it worked great, but it wasnt bad as far as i can tell. Took a tiny bit over 2 hrs. Legs were tired but got a chance to ride a bike for a mile home and it felt glorious compared to pavement pounding. I wasn’t expecting that at all.
I should have known better today to go out again, but it was so nice and i didnt feel bad at all. Mid 60s, but really high humidity, so much so it was almost drizzling. So the combo of humidity and general fatigue was not helping me, in fact i probably should have moved around the training and had a regen day, but i felt i could do a tempo run. I was almost right. Once i added in the hills, i was done for. Just killers today with the build up from yesterday.
I had to slow way way down at the end on the last uphill of and ended up do some downhill jogs to shake out the legs. Good times.
global_dev
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Just a spur of the moment 20k, no biggie!
Way to go Jon!
Thx, i think when I say it out loud it does sound kind of ridiculous and never in a million years would i have guessed i would/could pull something like that off.
global_dev
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Taking the day off from a run. It ends a little run streak, but gotta take some recovery time.
global_dev
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Been an interesting 2 weeks of training. really getting back into the swing of things with diversity in activity, but decided to take last weekend off as a rest while i traveled to NC on friday and back on Sun. Accumulated fatigue is reaaaaal. I am probably pushing my body a bit more than maintaing balance which is the point, but also a rest day or two should make feel better for the next session, but the stress from the weekends lack of sleep, driving long hours, and a bit more food and alcohol than I normally have felt like it took its toll and a couple of days to recover from. However, tuesday and thursday sessions felt great (took wed off by plan).
tuesday early evening was a slow 5K on relatively flat course, late evening was a no tech 5K+on my local hills. clearly the hills are rough, but i didn't understand how bad they were until last nights 5miler interval session. I had done a similar one last week thursday around my normal 5 mile locale, but yesterday waited till i had a 90 min training for my kid about 25 miles away from home.
thursday 5pm was out near a relatively flat area, some long hills but only 1 that was a pace killer towards the end. Perhaps i can blame on it the shoes, my fitness/fatigue, weather or just the day, but i really think it's the hills. My neighborhood is just really rough and i think yesterdays route was just so much easier and while it was a tough run because of the intervals, it felt so much better during and at the end. Longer distance and for the same time. And i felt "great" at the end, whereas i am normally pushing really hard the whole time from the beginning to end. Definitely different aspects of endurance and strength in these 2 courses.
i think in the next 2 weeks, i'll attempt some time trials to see my 1 mile and 5K times with all out hill free runs. i am curious to see if I've really improved since last year this time when i ran my last mile time trial attempt. I'll have to make sure i don't run too fast out of the gate trying to max my pace/min my time.
tuesday early evening was a slow 5K on relatively flat course, late evening was a no tech 5K+on my local hills. clearly the hills are rough, but i didn't understand how bad they were until last nights 5miler interval session. I had done a similar one last week thursday around my normal 5 mile locale, but yesterday waited till i had a 90 min training for my kid about 25 miles away from home.
thursday 5pm was out near a relatively flat area, some long hills but only 1 that was a pace killer towards the end. Perhaps i can blame on it the shoes, my fitness/fatigue, weather or just the day, but i really think it's the hills. My neighborhood is just really rough and i think yesterdays route was just so much easier and while it was a tough run because of the intervals, it felt so much better during and at the end. Longer distance and for the same time. And i felt "great" at the end, whereas i am normally pushing really hard the whole time from the beginning to end. Definitely different aspects of endurance and strength in these 2 courses.
i think in the next 2 weeks, i'll attempt some time trials to see my 1 mile and 5K times with all out hill free runs. i am curious to see if I've really improved since last year this time when i ran my last mile time trial attempt. I'll have to make sure i don't run too fast out of the gate trying to max my pace/min my time.
global_dev
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found some quick data on both interval sessions i talked about above. and it's definitely clear there is a significant enough elevation difference for me. and yesterdays actually had almost a one mile huge hill climb for warmup that wasn't recorded, so i should have been shot by the time i started this 5 miler. IIRC correctly, i ended last weeks early as i was just done before the last interval and the interval "work" lengths were 3 mins each instead of 4 mins (yesterday). the pace & power aren't great indicators as during the intervals rest phase, sometimes i jog and sometimes I walk, and sometimes the work phase I am on a hill going up or down, so perhaps a trend, but not a good one.
| Yesterday | Local | |
| Flat | Flat 3.58 mi (70%) 9:39/mi, 276 W | Flat 2.00 mi (43%) 10:24/mi, 257 W |
| Ascending | Ascending > +2% 0.53 mi (10%) 12:39/mi, 249 W | Ascending > +2% 1.28 mi (27%) 12:52/mi, 239 W |
| Descending | Descending < -2% 0.99 mi (20%) 8:32/mi, 272 W | Descending < -2% 1.42 mi (30%) 10:01/mi, 234 W |
global_dev
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just spent an hour or so inputting 2.5 months of Stryd Power based HM training into a Polar Flow "HM training program" (Polar is HR based training and doesn't allow workout import from other sources (allows export just fine) ,but with certain polar watches you can create power based phased workouts for the future. for more convenience and "complete" compatibility, i feel like Garmin products with Connect IQ app functionality would have been the way to go. Garmins more open functionality is just way more robust for the things I am trying to do it seems. However i have never tried one out and it could also be limited by 3rd party programming. just from what i keep seeing when looking for solutions to my issues. I think apple watches might also be more convenient but i don't think it can do it all concurrently and remembering to charge daily is not my greatest forte. Hopefully, i'll be ok with not focusing on all the data in one package, but some of these workarounds to find my most appealing integration would not have been known to me at the outset of this foray and individual product reviews don't get robust enough for me to know what's what early enough. That's okay, i'll eventually get it all sorted.
todays "medium" run, i really went out looking to keep HR even and contained within the zone 3 151-165bpm. wore some more NB max cushioned everyday/recovery shoes, they just feel slow and less responsive, i've heard newer current versions fix some of this. They are definitely comfortable, not my favorite, maybe it's just recovery style running shoes i need to get used to and that they aren't responsive tempo fast shoes and give the legs/body a bit of a break. About 40 mins to go 4.1 miles, not bad, nothing stellar. I had to take some new routes to add the last 15 mins and keep it relatively flat and keep the HR in check, i guess that good that I made it a bit farther at this HR than before, that's a nice trend.
todays "medium" run, i really went out looking to keep HR even and contained within the zone 3 151-165bpm. wore some more NB max cushioned everyday/recovery shoes, they just feel slow and less responsive, i've heard newer current versions fix some of this. They are definitely comfortable, not my favorite, maybe it's just recovery style running shoes i need to get used to and that they aren't responsive tempo fast shoes and give the legs/body a bit of a break. About 40 mins to go 4.1 miles, not bad, nothing stellar. I had to take some new routes to add the last 15 mins and keep it relatively flat and keep the HR in check, i guess that good that I made it a bit farther at this HR than before, that's a nice trend.
global_dev
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This weekend was driving about 200 miles round trip each day for a soccer tournament from DC area to richmond. Early in Saturday 8am ish on the road (not bad at all) back home at 7:30pm and really early on Sunday (left at 5:30 and came back in early afternoon). Really close to stay overnight there in hotel. Sometimes i do, sometimes not. Since the the team hotel was 30 mins from the field in my direction and 95south is usually low traffic that early, i opted to stay home. I think i made the right choice. The drives there were super easy and pre sunrise was beautiful with a bright moon to my left and dark blue skies and black treelines bracketing the road and sky. Listened to a few running podcasts while the fam slept.
Based on how tired i felt i would be on Sunday morning from the drive, standing in the sun and the excitement, i opted to move a 80min long run from sat to Sunday. It was a good decision. Beautiful afternoon trail run that i timed perfectly for an hour and a half. The last 10 mins after 80 min session was a 10 min uphill walk that I’ve mentioned before. Its a nice post cooldown walk uphill that stretches out my legs well.
A bit over 7miles in 80 mins. Not bad for also deciding to power walk the hills. Its really nice to wear trailrunning shoes with the grippy soft ground nubs on the soles compared to regular runner/trainers. No slipping feeling through the singletrack. But on the roads it not super pleasant (not terrible though) so i try to keep the grass sides if i can.
The percussive massage gun, the rollers, and the rest of the recovery stuff feels super important. I need to make sure i dont underdo recovery and overdo the sessions. Especially as the nicer weather comes along and it just feels nice to be outside.
Based on how tired i felt i would be on Sunday morning from the drive, standing in the sun and the excitement, i opted to move a 80min long run from sat to Sunday. It was a good decision. Beautiful afternoon trail run that i timed perfectly for an hour and a half. The last 10 mins after 80 min session was a 10 min uphill walk that I’ve mentioned before. Its a nice post cooldown walk uphill that stretches out my legs well.
A bit over 7miles in 80 mins. Not bad for also deciding to power walk the hills. Its really nice to wear trailrunning shoes with the grippy soft ground nubs on the soles compared to regular runner/trainers. No slipping feeling through the singletrack. But on the roads it not super pleasant (not terrible though) so i try to keep the grass sides if i can.
The percussive massage gun, the rollers, and the rest of the recovery stuff feels super important. I need to make sure i dont underdo recovery and overdo the sessions. Especially as the nicer weather comes along and it just feels nice to be outside.
global_dev
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Gotta be honest with you guys, I'm feeling pretty dang good today. Way way outside the comfort zone of what i think I should/could be doing in my late 40s. crossing my fingers.
Today is a gorgeous day and I just got back from my lunch run. A "Tempo" run! 40 awesome mins of moving more quickly than i feel like my body wants to. Even my 16yo kid the other day was completely flabbergasted by my training and response to it and i constantly tell her that i can't wait to run with her as she is getting back into more running movement after her ACL surgery last Oct so it'll be fun to watch her rebuild her fitness and strength.
After yesterday's long trail run and the weekend driving, wasn't sure how i'd feel today for a Tempo run, but I feel like i nailed the workout on the boardwalk. I don't normally say that about the workouts. I managed to keep my HR in the target zones for 100% of 40 minute run, a progressive pace of 9:47min/mile for 28 minutes and then 8:41mins/mile for the last 12mins. Feeling pretty good after the 5min recovery. Not a time trial, but pretty darn fast given the effort yesterday.
apparently missed two dozen or so turtles sunbathing on a small isle alongside the boadwalk path. saw a pic of it though from a walker i had passed earlier.
i was still about 1.25 miles from home and the home hill was just around the corner. I banged out the hill at 10:45 pace and felt like i made it mine when i finally had crested it (~115ft gained elevation in a half mile). yippy kai yay!
some thoughts, noticed that i really have to keep fro looking down as i run, i tend to look 45 degress at the ground, i need to be looking 75 degrees from the ground if not nearer to 90. i think this has the effect of tilting at the hips instead of the hips open. also noticed that it's "easier" to run at a higher speed, the mechanics are just there - at a slower pace they aren't.
i'm coming to really undertand that uphill/downhill doesn't utilize the same muscles as flats. i think that's why as i transition out of the hills into the flats, i'm just really feeling it instead of it being easier. shoes make a lot of difference, i;m not sure which shoes i prefer, but they feel different, and perform differently, the last 3-5 years has been a complete disruption of tech and performance. even for the average guy it helps in both effort and recovery abilities. it's not just for pros/semipros (elite/subelite) only. these new foams (and plates) are just ridic. i don't think 100% everyday in one thing is good, but adding it in once or twice a week and changing to recovery/general day trainers, is pretty good idea to keep the feet/legs/body using different muscles to adapt to the different stresses.
pretty good day today!
Today is a gorgeous day and I just got back from my lunch run. A "Tempo" run! 40 awesome mins of moving more quickly than i feel like my body wants to. Even my 16yo kid the other day was completely flabbergasted by my training and response to it and i constantly tell her that i can't wait to run with her as she is getting back into more running movement after her ACL surgery last Oct so it'll be fun to watch her rebuild her fitness and strength.
After yesterday's long trail run and the weekend driving, wasn't sure how i'd feel today for a Tempo run, but I feel like i nailed the workout on the boardwalk. I don't normally say that about the workouts. I managed to keep my HR in the target zones for 100% of 40 minute run, a progressive pace of 9:47min/mile for 28 minutes and then 8:41mins/mile for the last 12mins. Feeling pretty good after the 5min recovery. Not a time trial, but pretty darn fast given the effort yesterday.
apparently missed two dozen or so turtles sunbathing on a small isle alongside the boadwalk path. saw a pic of it though from a walker i had passed earlier.
i was still about 1.25 miles from home and the home hill was just around the corner. I banged out the hill at 10:45 pace and felt like i made it mine when i finally had crested it (~115ft gained elevation in a half mile). yippy kai yay!
some thoughts, noticed that i really have to keep fro looking down as i run, i tend to look 45 degress at the ground, i need to be looking 75 degrees from the ground if not nearer to 90. i think this has the effect of tilting at the hips instead of the hips open. also noticed that it's "easier" to run at a higher speed, the mechanics are just there - at a slower pace they aren't.
i'm coming to really undertand that uphill/downhill doesn't utilize the same muscles as flats. i think that's why as i transition out of the hills into the flats, i'm just really feeling it instead of it being easier. shoes make a lot of difference, i;m not sure which shoes i prefer, but they feel different, and perform differently, the last 3-5 years has been a complete disruption of tech and performance. even for the average guy it helps in both effort and recovery abilities. it's not just for pros/semipros (elite/subelite) only. these new foams (and plates) are just ridic. i don't think 100% everyday in one thing is good, but adding it in once or twice a week and changing to recovery/general day trainers, is pretty good idea to keep the feet/legs/body using different muscles to adapt to the different stresses.
pretty good day today!
global_dev
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Using the chest strap for HR
That froggin hill at the end
That froggin hill at the end
global_dev
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Todays an off day. I think i am missing out on running form drills. High knees, butt kickers, triple steps, a skips, b skips, carioca, etc. tbh, i dont know if these are considered warmups, a separate workout instead of or complementary to trainings. I’m guessing complementary. Probably need to ask some former collegiate runners i’ve talked to recently.
Yesterdays easy run was also a great weather day. 5k in 30 mins and actually wore the toe spacers i have while i ran. Didnt feel awkward but i think i need to cut down some of the structure to minimize space issues. Actually felt pretty good. I try to wear the spacers during the day but last couple of weeks i’ve lost track of wearing them. Supposedly they are designed to be used mostly while active.
Cardio wise the pace wasnt hard but it also definitely didnt feel super easy. Wondering if everything was catching up with me.
Been trying to go to sleep ~90mins earlier than usual to see if that helps recovery, 90 mins at night is an awful lot of time per week to get other shtuff done.
Also considering trying to get my runs in super early in the AM. My current lifestyle doesn’t support that yet. I know its gonna get pretty hot over the next 3 months and the summer mid days were brutal and humid. But iirc the early mornings were kind of humid too.
Yesterdays easy run was also a great weather day. 5k in 30 mins and actually wore the toe spacers i have while i ran. Didnt feel awkward but i think i need to cut down some of the structure to minimize space issues. Actually felt pretty good. I try to wear the spacers during the day but last couple of weeks i’ve lost track of wearing them. Supposedly they are designed to be used mostly while active.
Cardio wise the pace wasnt hard but it also definitely didnt feel super easy. Wondering if everything was catching up with me.
Been trying to go to sleep ~90mins earlier than usual to see if that helps recovery, 90 mins at night is an awful lot of time per week to get other shtuff done.
Also considering trying to get my runs in super early in the AM. My current lifestyle doesn’t support that yet. I know its gonna get pretty hot over the next 3 months and the summer mid days were brutal and humid. But iirc the early mornings were kind of humid too.
global_dev
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Nice cool day for a run. after some pretty tough reflection i decided i needed to switch up what i was doing in warmups and cooldowns. I think i just don’t know what i dont know. I’ve seen people talk about doing dynamic stretches before a run and I’ve done that mostly for 2-3 mins most runs, but the way polar presents/reports the overall run session, it feels like i should be warming up & cooling down with a slow jog. I dont think that’s appropriate 100% so today i spent 15mins doing some dynamic stretches and drills like i mentioned in the previous. Pretty tiring though lol.
Lets just say i didnt kill todays intervals. The hills are not conducive to finishing the sets even if the HR graphs look successful, but regardless i know i am getting better, so perhaps i did kill it for getting through it today. Thats all i got.
Lets just say i didnt kill todays intervals. The hills are not conducive to finishing the sets even if the HR graphs look successful, but regardless i know i am getting better, so perhaps i did kill it for getting through it today. Thats all i got.
global_dev
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woke up today and noticed some muscle soreness that I attribute to that dynamite warmup. won't say anymore about it, except i did again today and it felt slightly more coordinated/easier.
gorgeous day for a a"medium" bpm HR run for 45 mins. the medium run pushes it a bit on cumulative stress but it's really doable while remembering form. I love that I can do most of this during my lunch, however i think come april i have a couple days on my plan with much longer time session, so i'll have to figure something out.
gorgeous day for a a"medium" bpm HR run for 45 mins. the medium run pushes it a bit on cumulative stress but it's really doable while remembering form. I love that I can do most of this during my lunch, however i think come april i have a couple days on my plan with much longer time session, so i'll have to figure something out.