who can explain shoulders, stabilizers?

[jimmie]

they come in different designs. I'm not quite sure what I'm looking at, but if anybody can explain them that would be good.

I don't have any pictures I just get razors and they all have different designs, I narrowed it down to shoulder and stabilizer, but I don't know why or exactly what is referred to as the shoulder or the stabilizer

 

[Longhaultanker]

I’m attaching a couple of pictures of razors with shoulders and stabilizers. My understanding of these is to stabilize the blade or edge from flexing during the shave.

 

[bluesman]

My theory, from a razor makers perspective.

When the double wheel grinders came in to the manufacturing of razors, the grinding process involved moving the razor axially, from tip to heel, between the two fixed hard wheels. Doing this wears the corners of the wheel as that is where the majority of the abrasion is taking place. At the end of the rough grind stage, prior to heat treating, the grind of the razor is thicker at the heel end of the blade because of the uneven wear on the wheels. At the finish grinding stage, in order to minimize the uneven wear to the wheels, the cutler stops the grind a little short of the original shoulder and voila! we are left with what is called the stabilizer.

The name makes it sound like a feature instead of an artifact of the process. I hate them and none of my razors have them. Early on, before I started making razors, I removed the stabilizers from my vintage razors and I never notices any destabilization of the heel.

 

[supertrunker]

That wear on the front facing part of the grinding wheels though is because the blade has not been put between them squarely but rather at an angle? In other words a machine could do a better job with no need for that shoulder at all.

T

 

[jimmie]

My theory, from a razor makers perspective.

When the double wheel grinders came in to the manufacturing of razors, the grinding process involved moving the razor axially, from tip to heel, between the two fixed hard wheels. Doing this wears the corners of the wheel as that is where the majority of the abrasion is taking place. At the end of the rough grind stage, prior to heat treating, the grind of the razor is thicker at the heel end of the blade because of the uneven wear on the wheels. At the finish grinding stage, in order to minimize the uneven wear to the wheels, the cutler stops the grind a little short of the original shoulder and voila! we are left with what is called the stabilizer.

The name makes it sound like a feature instead of an artifact of the process. I hate them and none of my razors have them. Early on, before I started making razors, I removed the stabilizers from my vintage razors and I never notices any destabilization of the heel.

you removed them? LOL. I can't even imagine that I have seen them with nothing and then something and then like the ones of the pictures long hauler!

this is a hobby that keeps giving and giving just like a good Christmas

 

[jimmie]

That wear on the front facing part of the grinding wheels though is because the blade has not been put between them squarely but rather at an angle? In other words a machine could do a better job with no need for that shoulder at all.

T

now that I read you can take them off LOL I want them all off. they look okay but there's no way to make it look right you can't get into the corner because there's not actually a corner or is there? LOL they are just a hassle

 

[Longhaultanker]

I can certainly understand grinding off the shoulders of Gold Dollar straights, but please, for posterity’s sake don’t do so on quality vintage razors. On each of the razors pictured, and all my shoulder-ed quality produced razors, when honing, the heal can be easily honed when the shoulder is ground correctly. This true for most quality vintage razors and new production too. Some vintage razors that have found their way to Asian shores have had the shoulder and heal ground off at a diagonal angle. I have a nice Bengall with such a modified grind and you can see them frequently on eBay. I’d like to find the “joker” who did such to my Bengall. You want a shoulder-less razor, buy one like Dovo’s Bismarck.

 

[Bill M]

I don’t have any pictures to bring up, but the stabilizers in very common German forgings have the stabilizers as part of the die set. I understand that a single forge in Solingen supplies ALL currently manufactured blanks made in Germany. One can look at the very common form of the thumbnotched shoulderless 6/8 Bismarck form and see the similarity to all other 6/8 shoulderless razors forged in Germany.

It is my assumption that the stabilizers have and do serve as guides to expedite double wheel grinding. Something to do with the size and position sets of the grinding wheels.

I had been told by someone who has been to a number of Solingen razor makers that a single shoulder is an indicator of a half hollow grind and the double shoulder is indicative of the full hollow. I have only one half hollow grind and it is the only razor with a single shoulder.

A close look at pictures blanks for shoulderless razors show no stabilizers in the blanks at all.

 

[bluesman]

I don't know for certain, but I think the stabilizer did not appear before the invention of the double wheel grinders.

 

[jimmie]

I think that answered my questions LOL. when I started getting into these a half year ago I thought the ones with stabilizers were the coolest looking ones but now I've seen ones with nothing it just goes from a shank to a blade I have a wade and butcher that is like that and it is my favorite one. I just didn't know what the purpose was or anything else. I tried to sand one and they r a nuisance

not to worry tanker. I wouldn't know how to start sanding on one of those but all I have is sandpaper and a fairly old elbow would not much grease left in the tank LOL I won't be making any changes to any. and I agree with you now that I kind of know what I'm looking at I see some of them that are pretty messed up LOL but, but, I might have thought it was really cool a few months ago

bill, I can only jump so high, and that went over my head LOL. I kind of get what you're talking about and that would be neat to visit some of those places. I wish an idea would hurry up and come to me to try and get people back into this. I said wet shaving to my son and he said, what? LOL but it's all good I love reading the histories on different companies like Jr Torrey or Morley w & b, case etc. lots of Brothers went on to have their own companies seems like there's a 20-year period from each generation and that's it. that was all she wrote those families might have looked back to their great great grandparents and maybe even new them but one guy I was reading got attacked by two bulls when he was walking with an umbrella LOL. just enjoying a nice day with your little gay umbrella twirling it keeping the shade on your head, and a couple bulls said have a horn to the head and he died in his 50s I can't think of who that was it was not a real popular brand, hawcroft.