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Jon’s musing about running and things about running while running and after running and probably before running too

GearNoir said:
Good on you for touching it out! Glad nothing bad happened, like Jon found burnt to a crisp on the trail 😂
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Seriously, totally agree. It was so hot and my body so tired i knocked on a “neighbors” door with less than a mile to go(but uphill) to get a refill of my water bottle. I stopped in every piece of shade i could find. This was probably my slowest mile EVER and it killed my PR attempt 😛.
 
I think i mentioned wet bulb recently and me using an app goodtorun to see conditions. An article popped up that’s interesting referring to it.

www.vice.com

Scientists Studying Temperature at Which Humans Spontaneously Die With Increasing Urgency

"Wet-bulb" conditions are when heat and humidity can cause otherwise healthy humans to overheat and die. They're happening more often than ever.
www.vice.com www.vice.com

“Wet bulb temperature is the point at which humidity and heat hit a point where evaporation due to sweat no longer works to cool a person.

Wet bulb conditions occur when relative humidity is above 95 percent and temperatures are at least 88 degrees F, according to the study. The human body, Horton's study found, is essentially unable to withstand wet bulb conditions at all once temperatures hit 95 degrees F. Under these conditions, it's possible for otherwise healthy people to die.
“Even if they're in perfect health, even if they're sitting in the shade, even if they're wearing clothes that make it easy in principle to sweat, even if they have an endless supply of water,” Horton said. “If there's enough moisture in the air, it's thermodynamically impossible to prevent the body from overheating.”

it’s pretty darn close recently. Today at noon it was WBGT of 93°. I’d be curious to know what it was yesterday. Especially with the high humidity i felt in the forest along the wetlands. I’m wondering if getting close to this is what made me feel that poorly. I was soaked in sweat and felt just felt drained
 
I’ve been thinking and reflecting on that Tuesday run. Probably gonna not do that again soon. I dont have the wet bulb globe temp from the app tues. but this was the local weather at 12-2. Clearly not ideal conditions.


F1467F40-BC20-4FD7-9FEF-51327A01E06B.jpeg


i’m glad i got out there, but probably should look to do things earlier and later in the day. Maybe even stash a water bottle half way out somewhere on the path.

Also remembered that I decided to cut off the music at mile 7 and just enjoy the sounds of the environment which was birds, squirrels and a light breeze.

the more research i do, the more i realize that improvements are slow and come from a lot of effort to balance efficiency and strength. Probably need to keep on the training path that has variety and good nutrition.
 
Been running an a different locale, away for a bit on Long Island and no hills at all on my route, ot almost none. It’s like a bizarre planet where everything is or feels flat for miles and miles and miles. I could find some hills but not like the ones at home. And not in the same way. Incredible

i now have the experience/knowledge of the significant difference in the 2 experiences, hills vs not hills.

only done 4 runs on the flat areas but it feels like a different slog altogether
 
I thought i had made huge headway into footwear and not needing to search for fit for me. I’ve bought a lot of kit blind buy that has fit really well. I’ve tried on some models at nike, adidas clearance stores (not outlets, seems to be a big difference in selection between those two types) but its clear that i may have just been navigating a really long and narrow path between sizes/models shapes of different companies. And as soon as i venture out, shoes dont fit.

most average priced adidas, new balance, nike, dont fit well. And the outlets and sneaker stores dont 95% carry the actual running lines. So its been odd choices at running stores that don’t typically price well for me or even have a good selection in my size. So online ordering is where its at, with decent return policies and paypal support.

I wanted to try on some skechers (believe it or not their running line has been heavily praised over last couple of years) but i cant find them in person.

my biggest successes have been heavily discounted past season at nike, saucony, brooks, and reebok.

I’ve put on about 2500 miles in 13 months and at my weight and form, i dont feel that shoes are lasting as long as a typical proficient runner that proclaims shoes last 500-600+ miles. I’m seeing/feeling less than half and thats ok.

some running in a pair of asics novablasts in july show that my gait is way affected by shoe than lets say the saucony kinvara. The asics have me midfoot striking while the kinvara have me at forefoot. That’s really interesting because i would have logically thought the opposite in shoes with a lower heel than forefoot ratio (low drop), but i do know that no drop skews to forefoot so it’s a fact. And that one thing changes the entire experience. Add cushioning, weight, foot shape and whatever else like tech of cushioning, laces, lacing, tongue material/gusset and all really feels like it impacts the experience and potential efficiency, which adds up to different enjoyment in this activity, at least for me. (as well as potential soreness, injury, etc).

i feel like some days i want a no shoe experience and some days i like the monster cushioning and others a huge toe off.

some days i like pounding the pavement and some i like the technical trail. Some days i like a solo run, others a companion is nice to have. I really like hills, i didnt expect that. At least not in a neighborhood. Maybe on a running tour it would be more inter.

I thought i would enjoy the flats and perhaps increased efficiency, but it wasnt all that.

I miss the colder weather running compared to the high humidity and uv of the summer, i even appreciate a slog through a downpour more than the wet heat.

To wrap it all up, I’m not sure why, but whenever i see someone jogging in the early evening (like 8pm) i always feel like I should be out there too, Even if i already did earlier, i know my body cant handle all that strain right now so no biggie, but it feels like it would be more “something“ positive and enjoyable to get out early and also later. But its not. I think that’s how the long walk helps me get over that mental idea.

i do like the feeling that i havent had to take any days offs for the flu or cold (or covid) so i may wear that mask forever.
 
global_dev said:
That’s really interesting because i would have logically thought the opposite in shoes with a lower heel than forefoot ratio (low drop)
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Trying to make sure i said that right.

higher heel than forefoot is higher drop - like high heel shoes - mid foot strike for me

lower drop to no drop is forefoot strike for me
 
This week has been an interesting week for reflecting about running as it's been just over 12 months since I really started my running hobby. I bought my first pair of serious running shoes at that time. I'm not sure if I was overzealous when I posted my Jun 2021 goals

target goals
  • 10K at 9min miles at 135HR
  • 5k in 21mins
  • 2miles in 12mins
  • 1mile in 5mins
i'll come back to them in a minute

I kind of forgot about that until this AM when i thought i should look back on some older posts to see how its going. I was surprised yesterday when my 5K training plan said that my "race" date was coming up next week. It's pretty much keeping me "thoughtful" towards goals and I was contemplating planning out a season using the polar app planner. That's probably going to require a bit more thought as I'll have to identify races/goals and training at a more thoughtful level.

I define any running (really getting off the couch) as success, no matter the distance or pace. That's actually been hard to fully recognize and I while I can definitely see/feel how important recovery is (physical and mental rest, easy activity, cross training) it's hard to embody mentally. additionally, I've been varying up the training and activity to make sure I'm not get repetitive stress injuries. And sometimes that variation feels like its not enough work. Not a great feeling tbh... gotta get past that

this week i was back in my hilly neighborhood, it felt really good to have that back. so strange to say that, but the mental/physical challenges are just so different. Yesterdays run was intervals and it felt great to get that out of the way for so many reasons. and so back to those goals

I clearly have been getting better at running efficiency. I'm not sure I have gotten a lot faster as I though I might. maybe next weeks "race" run will show some gains that aren't visible during training. maybe its the shoes, no joke, the immediate current crop of modern cushion & plated shoes has many many people running way faster. If running was an equation, the shoes can take out more of the pain and can increase efficiency, letting you run faster and longer. I'm not really relying or counting on that, but it's very interesting to note.

But i feel way better during and after my run, I feel like I have gears, I can move better physically and mentally, form and flexibility is better, i think i have overall better expectations and understanding of what to expect. I'm no expert, but i have learned a bunch that makes me feel like I am progressing towards the goals.

That early July almost Half Marathon was killer, I'll try to mitigate some of those risks, but I thoroughly enjoyed it.

I don't think I am at that goals stated above, but I haven't tested to them.. which I may have to plan for my season as "races"

but for sure, i will not meet some of these realistically. especially not on my hills route, which is the baseline

  • 10K at 9min miles at 135HR - i don't i can make the HR goal ( i think I am closer to a 150 avg, but the distance and speed is close)
  • 5k in 21mins - i am aiming for 5k in 25 mins (this is my main goal for now)
  • 2miles in 12mins - probably closer to 2 miles in 17 mins
  • 1mile in 5mins - probably closer to 7:30
 
I'm finding its kind of hard to remember most of the stuff i thing about when i run (oh the irony). especially since a lot of my runs lately have been solo and i think quite a lot, but today was kind of humbling and reminds me that the comparison is the thief of joy. I was feeling real good for the first 5K today, wasn't sure how I was gonna feel after and I figured i'd work on a couple hills for another 5K. some new hills to add, just 2, and i really felt them but i consistently persevered making sure to not to get lazy. I think i mentioned it before, but my pace up the hill is good but when i get to the top it slows considerably quickly, i would have thought it would be easier to continue, but it just doesn't happen, wonder if that's common. similar running steep downhills tend to tire me by the time i am a 50-75 meters from the base and trying to normalize the pace.

I ended up passing around mile 6 feeling pretty good, just around an hour in and out of the corner of my eye I see an older, considerably, gent behind me about less than a block and i just felt without looking that he was gaining on me. As I was going slightly uphill, boom right as I crest the hill, he passes me looking fresh and clean. i feel really tired, knowing i only have a mile left to get home., i think moving pretty decently, but not fast for sure, but not slow. there he was just whisking his feet along at a clip, no heel lift, no knee bend, mostly hip, that surpassed mine at that moment and for that moment i did not feel great... i felt a bit overwhelmed by it and underwhelmed by my performance at the same time. I don't know when he started, how far he was going, how much experience he has and no one knows the same about me.. but it was bad inspiration. I knew I just needed my own pace and effort.. not to try to impress anyone or myself so for the last 1/2 mile i worked on some form for some more hills and over that distance felt my calves tightening and i had to let that last 1/4 mile go once they curled up and walk. no need to injure myself. tomorrows another day. but man, it sucks to get passed.

btw, i saw a commercial today on TV about some older guy (whats with the older guys common denominators in this post?) talking about how some medicine let him continue his activeness and he ends it by saying "i ran 3 and a half marathons in the last 75 days, what did you do?" what a jerk. who talks like that?!
 
just finished a long run according to polar and was reading into decoupled power and HR. i stumbled upon a resource called intervals.icu and it showed a slightly different zone setup than polar

Heart Rate Training Zones edit
Z1Recovery0 - 84%0 - 146
Z2Aerobic84% - 89%147 - 155

and not really sure it changes much, but my polar zone 2 tops out at ~134bpm currently. If i recall my MAF score was close to my polar zone. I guess it's helpful either way z2 is calculated.

ran the run at a really slow pace, about 12min/mile and a avg HR of 141. it was 35mins at z2 and 10 mins at z3 before my "cool down" which isn't a proper cooldown. I think the HR will eventually get there, and since I've not got this number from any medical appraisal, I'm OK with the lack of specificity.

the run was pretty easy except for trying to get under the z2 threshold. went with my 2 kids who need to get back into the more active lifestyle, we had a good time. its a pace easy enough for me to converse, the younger kid absolutely needed the distraction and encouragement as the miles racked up and she was feeling the burn early.

related, learned quite a bit from reading about & watching the olympics on racing tactics and strategies. kind of cool, enjoyable to see what goes into a race... not sure i'll ever need it, except racing my kids...
 
Cool that the kids dragged the old man along! Good solid activity together that still allows plenty of space for being silent in the moment.
 
did 7 miles today at consistent cadence, surprisingly considering that was not the goal, the goal was a 10K keeping the HR under 140 and i was very close. pace ended up at 12min/mile up and down every hill. felt pretty good. it looks and feels really slow... i just go with it.
 
i've kept the running up as much as I can which has been surprising as my kids school and sports schedule is ramping up.

I switched shoes for the last three runs from the asics novablast (mid foot striking) to brooks levitate 2 (forefoot striking) according to my data. there may be more to look in the specific shoe sata differences, but i ma noting that the major data log difference i see OVERALL on the way I run is that the left leg vertical impact is significantly more than my right leg.

from most obvious reasons to consider to least (i have no idea whether any are significant factors) :

  1. I am right side dominant
  2. I broke my right tibial plateau a couple years ago.
  3. i run on crowned roads/sloping paths
  4. my left leg is weaker
  5. i shift weight becuase of shoe wear/cushioning
  6. general strain due to overuse, my right leg seems to more commonly feel calf/achilles/soleous issues
  7. ?

I may decide to get a professional opinion eventually, but i'll start with keeping form, both fresh and tired, take some video, and see if shoes affect it. i don't recall seeing this imbalance last year and i wouldn't have seen it without the data analysis, could be just the way i run and not much i can do for now.

I've been running through just south of DC along the Potomac river and there is just so much foot traffic on the paths (walking, jogging, bicycles, scooters) no real stops, but also not a lot of shade.

had a double header training yesterday for my kids. 2 90 min sessions. first session, I ran 2 miles with a friend for the first time ever and it was interesting, we talked about expectations and towards the middle, it was clear he was not going to be able to finish the 5K I was planning to run. we were also going kind of slow, which was nice and the actual plane just trying to keep HR under 150, but i could see he was hurting around a mile or so. I had 90 mins to kill, so I went for another slow run for 5K and finished out the day before i had to drive home.

so much new things to look at, including so many runners to look at for technique, kit, etc.. very interesting
 
Yesterday i tried to keep a pace of 9min/mile over my 5 mile local route. It was tough, i barely made it 52 mins, the uphills just killed my pace and energy. i probably need to better strategize the route to compensate. Perhaps the humidity played a role, the WBGT was 82° and startwd the run at 11am which was slightly ok to start but to much too end at 12. It started to lightly rain with flash flood warning at 11:15 for about 15 mins but the rest of the run was more or less dry.

wore brooks ricochet v1 shoes and they felt a bit hard at beginning and pretty decent from halfway on. 8mm drop ~ 10.3oz / 292.0g for the std size. A bit lighter and stiffer than the levitate2s. Way less cushion than the asics novablasts.

I spent a lot of time trying to feel out the RvL impact data i was seeing and from first appearances i am gonna guess that the harder left impact is due to a suspect right leg issue. The left movement doesnt feel bad, perhaps the back swing to foot strike is slightly off but the left didnt feel objectively stiff, it felt like the right was bending more. Video at a track would probably help just need to find a track.
 
GearNoir said:
Never realized how much science and analysis goes into running 😵
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i dont think youd be suprised by the availability of sports/rehab related private clinics that have popped over the last decade to eek out gains, but also the university level interest in sports/rehab research available to the public (at a price). Its on the extreme sides of both preventive and sick health care.

Tbh, i dont think the average jogger/runner thinks much about what i have been doing. They probably think i am overdoing it. our goals are overlapping to some degree but just like our shave experience, the rabbit hole is deep if you decide to train and enjoy the breadth and depth running has to offer.

i have a friend who runs a mile everyday in bis neighborhood or so and has no interest in any of the things i am looking at. But for me the running related videos on youtube and articles are tremendous.

the data i am looking at it is so specialized i doubt any but doctors and training fans are interested in the investment and investigation. the data these tools produce for feedback and application is hopefully gonna to push me in the correct direction with facts and wisdom and get me to enjoy it earlier and keep me interested longer.
 
GearNoir said:
Never realized how much science and analysis goes into running
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Oh believe it. I’m like “Hey that guy looks healthy running” “But it would be nice if his shorts weren’t so short” “I should have started running when I was younger. It would keep a person in shape.” “I bet that guy stinks to high heaven when he gets home” “Which liquor store was I headed to?”
 
NurseDave said:
Oh believe it. I’m like “Hey that guy looks healthy running” “But it would be nice if his shorts weren’t so short” “I should have started running when I was younger. It would keep a person in shape.” “I bet that guy stinks to high heaven when he gets home” “Which liquor store was I headed to?”
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Aint that the truth. I noticed that a lot of folks feel awkward around the short shorts on men… i just watched a YT video on it coincidentally earlier this week


i honestly feel like basketball shorts have gone too far for me. Running in 9”+ inseam is ridiculous, 5-7 is kinda ok, probably need to get some silkies to try.
 
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